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Reinhardt: In my time, Medicare has been a pioneer in innovating with the DRG (diagnosis-related group)--based hospital payment system, which has been copied worldwide, and the Medicare physician fee schedule, which has been copied by private American payers. If we are ever going to really test managed competition by having health plans compete fairly for enrollees, only HCFA (the Health Care Financing Administration) can actually show the way, because the private sector has not yet done it so far. Do you share that view?
Shalala: I share that view, but the political system has to buy into it. For instance, we've announced a competitive-bidding demonstration in which we have some consensus among the experts as to where we ought to go and how to organize our experiment with managed competition. Phoenix and Kansas City are our two sites.
Reinhardt: HCFA has attempted such demonstrations in Baltimore and Denver but was forced to abandon both efforts by private interests that were opposed to them.
Shalala: Yes, in Denver we had bipartisan support to try it. But when we got specific and picked the places, we immediately had political opposition. However, Congress directed us (in the Balanced Budget Act [BBA] of 1997) to try again. We set up an advisory panel on which all of the political interests were represented. And now we're proceeding again.
Reinhardt: I suppose that we should never expect the managed care industry to voluntarily acquiesce to a competitive-bidding process because people instinctively don't like to compete. They prefer administered prices because such prices can be manipulated politically. Who is it, in general, that opposes competitive bidding?
Shalala: One source of opposition is the managed care industry. The companies in that industry believe that such a process will undermine their profits. So the private sector--the famed competitive marketplace--doesn't want competition. They keep saying things like, ``Health care is different; we can't predict our costs.'' We have to have a system that is more nimble, more flexible. Managed care plans would not oppose a competitive-bidding process if they could modify the package of benefits. But if HCFA locks them into a benefits package, they want to be able to negotiate the price, rather than making competitive bids.
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