Copyright 2002 The New York Times Company
The New York Times
May 3, 2002 Friday
Correction Appended
Late Edition - Final
SECTION: Section A; Column 1; National Desk; Pg. 20

LENGTH: 796 words

HEADLINE: 4 Lawmakers Urge Transportation Dept. to Allow Pilots to Carry Guns

BYLINE: By MATTHEW L. WALD

DATELINE: WASHINGTON, May 2

BODY:


Four senators said today that they wanted the airlines and the Transportation Department to let pilots carry guns, and a safety expert from the Boeing Company told a House subcommittee that the company's planes could withstand multiple bullet holes without major risk.

The aviation security bill that Congress passed in November left it to the Transportation Department whether pilots should be allowed to carry guns or nonlethal weapons, but the department has not decided, and a growing number of lawmakers want to give pilots the right to bear arms on the job.

"We trust the pilots with our lives," said Senator Zell Miller, Democrat of Georgia. "It's time to trust them with firearms."

Mr. Miller appeared with a group of pilots and several Senate colleagues to support the idea, although Tom Ridge, the director of homeland security, has spoken against it, and the airlines do not like the idea.

Some critics are concerned that guns may reduce safety because an armed pilot might leave the cockpit to help flight attendants with a problem in the cabin, while an unarmed pilot would be more likely to stay safely behind the newly reinforced door. Another question is whether an airline would be liable if a pilot shot the wrong person, like a passenger trying to help subdue a hijacker.

Supporters of the idea said that legislation could solve the liability questions and that pilots could be taught to stay put and use the gun only as a last line of defense. The current last line of defense, several noted, consists of fighter jets flown by Air National Guard pilots, many of whom are airline pilots called to active duty since Sept. 11.

"Doesn't it seem reasonable to insert one more preventive step, before an F-16 launches a missile against a passenger plane?" said Representative John Hostettler, Republican of Indiana, appearing with the senators and the pilots.

Senator Conrad Burns, Republican of Montana, said, "If a person, or a party of people, want to die in the commitment of an act, as they did on Sept. 11, it makes sense to this old cowboy that it would help if they died before they got it done."

Republican Senators Frank H. Murkowski of Alaska and Robert C. Smith of New Hampshire also said pilots should be able to carry guns.

On the House side, the chairman of the Transportation Committee, Representative Don Young, Republican of Alaska, and the chairman of the aviation subcommittee, Representative John L. Mica, Republican of Florida, introduced legislation on Wednesday to ensure that pilots who wanted to carry guns could do so. Supporters would have the pilots go through training and then be deputized by the federal government.

Ronald J. Hinderberger, director of aviation safety at Boeing Commercial Airplanes, told the panel that a bullet hole or two would not depressurize a plane. Even if a bullet shattered a window, he said, "there would be little hazard to continued safe flight and landing." Shooting in a plane had only a "remote possibility of causing a fire, explosion, engine failure or loss of critical systems," Mr. Hinderberger said.

None of the major airlines have expressed support for guns in the cockpit, said Michael Wascom, a spokesman for their trade group, the Air Transport Association. United Airlines has trained 7,000 of its 9,500 pilots to use a Taser, a stun gun the police use to subdue people. The airline would like to put Tasers in all its planes, in contrast to guns, which would be aboard only if the crew on that flight wanted to have them.

The Transportation Department has not decided if stun guns will be allowed, either, a spokeswoman, Dierdre O'Sullivan, said.

A Justice Department official, Sarah V. Hart, said stun guns "have the potential to thwart an attack." But other witnesses said they were about as versatile as a musket, firing only one or two shots before they required reloading, and would not stop teams of terrorists, like those on Sept. 11. Captain Stephen Luckey, chairman of the security committee of the Air Line Pilots Association, said police officers using Tasers had their guns as backup.

Some members of Congress are opposed as well. Eleanor Holmes Norton, the delegate to the House from the District of Columbia, said homeowners who bought guns to guard against burglars were more likely to shoot a relative or commit suicide, and a cockpit gun might also be used for unintended purposes.

The airlines see a potential distraction. "Pilots should be pilots and concentrate on flying the plane and remain in cockpit," Mr. Wascom, the trade group spokesman, said. "Leave law enforcement to trained professionals."

"We have fortified, reinforced cockpit doors and armed federal air marshals, Mr. Wascom added, "the combination of which we believe provides adequate on-board protections."


URL: http://www.nytimes.com

CORRECTION-DATE: May 4, 2002

CORRECTION:


An article yesterday about efforts to let pilots carry guns on the job misspelled the given name of a spokeswoman who said the Transportation Department had not decided whether stun guns would be allowed. She is Deirdre O'Sullivan, not Dierdre.

GRAPHIC: Photo: Senator Robert C. Smith, Republican of New Hampshire, was among those in Washington yesterday urging that pilots be able to carry guns. (Associated Press)

LOAD-DATE: May 3, 2002